Posted by Jerry Stuckle on 12/03/06 14:53

Tony Marston wrote:
> "Jerry Stuckle" <jstucklex@attglobal.net> wrote in message
> news:4qOdnXfE6PHdDOzYnZ2dnUVZ_u2dnZ2d@comcast.com...
>
>>Tony Marston wrote:
>
> <snip>
>
>>>I suggest you learn to read. The article by Craig Larman clearly states
>>>"In it, Parnas introduces information hiding. Many people have
>>>misinterpretted this term as meaning data encapsulation, and some books
>>>erroneously define the concepts as synonyms"
>>>Do you see? "Encapsulation" is not supposed to mean "data encapsulation".
>>>
>>
>>Yes, I suggest you learn to read, Tony. Start with the real experts.
>>
>>You're just a stupid troll who looks around for someone to support his
>>position. Read the authors I recommended.
>>
>>And no, I don't need to read any more of your "experts". I've read enough
>>to see that you really don't understand what they're talking about.
>>
>>
>>>
>>>>This is something on which EVERY expert agrees. But you fail to
>>>>understand.
>>>
>>>
>>>Not EVERY export. Some agree, some don't..
>>>
>>
>>OK, every RECOGNIZED expert. That does not include the "experts" trolls
>>like you recognize. Nor anyone who posts an essay or blog on the web.
>
>
> Oh I see. Someone is not an expert unless you personally give them your seal
> of approval. That is NOT how it works.
>

That's hilarious. You think you're an expert because you one time
worked on one failed OO project. Try working on a few dozen successful
ones. Then maybe you'll learn someone.

And these are experts recognized by the INDUSTRY. People who have been
doing OOAD for years. University Professors. Industry giants. And so on.

But you think anyone who doesn't agree with you doesn't know anything.
You are beyond stupid, Tony. And people laugh at you.

>
>>>>And the same thing with Craig Larman's article. He agrees that
>>>>encapsulation is good because it hides the design details. No one ever
>>>>claimed it hid information.
>>>>
>>>>Wrong on both counts, Tony the Troll. Learn to read.
>
>
> I suggest YOU learn to read. Encapsulation is NOT the same as data hiding.
>

And I suggest you learn to read. I never said encapsulation had
anything do to with data hiding. But you're too stoopid to understand
that, either.

>
>>>"Encapsulation" is not supposed to mean "data encapsulation". It is
>>>supposed to hide the implemetation (code), not the information (data).
>>>
>>
>>Encapsulation includes bot DATA AND CODE. How information is stored is
>>part of the implementation, also. But that's what you can't get through
>>your thick skull.
>
>
> Encapsulation means "implementation hiding" not "information hiding". I do
> not need private/protected variables to implement encapsulation.
>

Exactly. And how data is stored is part of the implementation. But
again, you're too stoopid to understand that part.

>
>>Maybe if you stood up and took a load off of your brain you could think
>>more clearly. I'd suggest you take a shit but I'm afraid you'd loose what
>>ever brains you might have.
>>
>>
>>>>>>This is in perfect agreement with Booch, Rumbaugh, Iverson and others.
>>>>>>And a direct CONTRADICTION to troll Tony Marston.
>
>
> And other experts, such as Martin Fowler.
>

And no, your beloved Martin Fowler is not a widely recognized expert.
Not like Booch, Rumbaugh and Iverson, for three. But even so, Martin
Fowler agrees with the other three experts. But you're too stoopid to
understand that, either.

>
>>>>>>>>>>It's not worth getting into the argument. He's just a troll with
>>>>>>>>>>delusions of competency.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>If everyone who disagrees with you is incompetent then the world is
>>>>>>>>>full of idiots. Your opinion is not the only opinion, and there are
>>>>>>>>>plenty of "experts" who have opposing views.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>No, I disagree with a lot of competent people. It's YOU who are an
>>>>>>>>incompetent troll. And you continue to prove it.
>>>
>>>
>>>I see. I agree with some of the people that you disagree with, yet that
>>>makes me a troll.
>>>
>>
>>No, you're a troll because you come into a tread and start arguing your
>>case.
>
>
> That is what newsgroups are for, to expose different points of view.
>

Yea, but the problem is you can't keep people like Tony Marston with
shit for brains out, either. But that's ok, there are a lot of people
getting a big laugh at you.

Imaging - calling yourself an "expert" when you've only worked on one
project - which failed. ROFLMAO!

>
>> You refuse to read industry-recognized experts, but quote blogs by people
>>who agree with you.
>
>
> I read from a different set of experts, as do many others.
>

And your "experts" are not recognized by the industry. They're just
like you - poor wanna-be's with a web site and delusions of competence.
People who are so desperate for attention they'll post any bullshit
they can find, just to get attention.

>
>>And even when you post a page of someone who agrees with me and I point it
>>out, you refute it and change the subject - finding another unknown
>>"expert" to support your claim.
>
>
> So you agree that there are others out there, expert or not, who share MY
> opinion and which contradicts YOUR opinion.
>

Sure, there are people who don't understand OO, encapsulation and the
rest. In fact, I'll bet bet Hillary Clinton would agree with you. And
she's even famous!

>
>>Also, I challenge you to find even ONE college level OO course in the U.S.
>>which agrees with you. I bet you can't. So I guess all those professors
>>are wrong, also.
>
>
> If they are teaching that there is only one way to interpret what OO means,
> and only one way to implement that interpretation, then they ARE wrong. Just
> like those religious fanatics who preach that theirs is the ONE and ONLY
> "true" faith.
>

So now you're saying even all the colleges and universities in this
country are wrong, also, because they don't agree with Tony Marston?

ROFLMAO!

>
>>You are a troll because you have absolutely no idea of which you talk.
>
>
> I have an open mind. I am prepared to listen to all arguments before I
> decide which path to follow. And I choose NOT to follow your particular
> path.
>

That is the best line you've come up with yet, Tony!

No, you don't have an open mind. Your mind is fixated on how YOU think
things should be, and the rest of the world should conform to YOUR
ideas. And anyone who disagrees with you is wrong - including all
colleges, universities, industry-recognized experts...

That is not an open mind, Tony. That's a sign of megalomania. And
you're a troll, on top of it.

>
>>You have no real experience outside of your little bubble, yet claim you
>>are an expert.
>
>
> I have never claimed to be an expert, unlike YOU. All I have done is pointed
> out that other experts have opinions which differ from yours.
>

You have posted no "experts" who's opinions differ from mine. All
you've posted are blogs and other website entries by people no one else
knows.

> < snip>
>
>>And you won't even read the industry experts. Your mantra is:
>>"I've made up my mind. Don't confuse me with the facts".
>
>
> That's funny. I thought that was YOUR mantra.
>

Nope, the facts I have are from recognized experts. You have no real
experience in OO, you have not read industry experts, you haven't even
taken a college course on OOAD. And yet you think everyone else is wrong.

> <snip>
>
>>The difference is my "bullshit" is supported by industry-recognized
>>techniques. Yours is only supported by unknown people who are trying to
>>get their names out.
>
>
> So Martin Fowler is not a recognised expert?
>

Not as widely recognized as Booch, Rumbaugh and Iverson, amongst others.
And even so, if you really read what he says, he does agree with the
three above.

> < snip>
>
>>>>Try working on an OO project with > 100 programmers. Learn how to do
>>>>proper OO.
>
>
> That's the problem. Different people have a totally different idea as to
> what "proper OO" actually is. You are the arrogant one who keeps insisting
> that YOUR opinion is the ONLY opinion worth having.
>

Yes, you are arrogant, Tony. And I can see why they fired your ass from
the project.

--
==================
Remove the "x" from my email address
Jerry Stuckle
JDS Computer Training Corp.
jstucklex@attglobal.net
==================

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