Posted by ^reaper^ on 11/03/56 11:25

While sipping absinthe, Onideus Mad Hatter heard a loud sucking noise
coming from alt.2600, and hastily inscribed the following unintelligible
Sanskrit in <news:to5fg1tka2vi3n0jgee1h33d4t8nhdf3fl@4ax.com>:

> On Sat, 20 Aug 2005 13:29:18 -0700, "^reaper^" <knocking@deaths.door>
> wrote:
>
>>> ECMAScript isn't JavaScript you blithering idiot.
>
>>I take it you didn't get teh memo? You know, the one Netscape published
>>when they released ECMAScript using the product name, "JavaScript"? Oh,
>>that's right, I keep forgetting. You were like... what? A tweenybopper at
>>teh time? o_O
>
> ...um, MORON, Netscape published JavaScript, NOT ECMAScript. The
> first edition of ECMAScript didn't come until about TWO YEARS after
> Netscape first released JavaScript and it was release by ECMA, it
> didn't have fuck all to do with Netscape at that point.

Oh chit. You're right. My bad. o_O

>>> You could say that JavaScript is like a dialect of ECMAScript...kinda.
>>> More accurately ECMA is essentially like the W3C...W3C isn't a markup
>>> language, they just give proposed standards on specifications of markup.
>>> The same can be said of ECMA, they give a proposed standard specification
>>> but script makers are free to do whatever they like.
>
>>Do try to keep up. JavaScript _is_ ECMAScript,
>
> Nope, sorry stupid. If anything you could say that ECMAScript is
> JavaScript (or the parts of it they liked anyway), but not so much the
> other way around. If you wanna call JavaScript a dialect of
> ECMAScript I'd give that to ya too. And no, you don't get a cookie
> for being stupid.

JavaScript morphed to adhere to ECMA-262 after teh standards were pub'd in
'96. As with most langs, after ns released the lang in '95, and it took
off, standards were put in place. That they were put in place so early in
teh game (e.g., it wasn't even stable at that time), teh js is barely a
flavor of it's original self. Hth!

>>> ...I don't know why you're trying to compare JavaScript to ActionScript...
>>> base syntax is similar but ActionScript 2.0 is like WAY different..
>>> ActionScript includes quite a bit of features.
>
>>Maybe cuz it's ECMAScript with additional /canned/ objects and prototypes,
>>yathink?
>
> ...and what do you think JavaScript is, you MORON.

Heh. I'm not teh one who was bragging about not having to use js. No
matter. I could give a flying rat's ass what you call it. You're still
dealing with the ECMAScript syntax and rules, whether you call it js,
ecmascript, livescript, or kalamazoo. So you get some different features.
Big whoopdeeding. You still need a solid understanding of ECMAScript. That
or you can settle for making teh same idiotic mistakes regardless of which
flavor you choose.

>>No matter. From what I can tell from teh last js snippet, you know, the one
>>you psoted before you went galloping off on teh flash trail? You haven't
>>yet figured out how to reduce redundant code (e.g., your seperate functions
>>for teh duplicated flipper routines).
>
> Reaper apparently thinks that cause she knows about some arbitrary
> coding methodology that, that somehow makes her fuckup about ECMA less
> poignant.

If you do not understand /why/ redundancy is a problem, I suggest you take
that piece of paper you recently received and ask for a refund. Maybe even
sue their ass for not teaching you rudimentary programming concepts.

> Of course, what Reaper fails to comprehend is that I DID test her
> methodology...quite thoroughly in fact...and then I tested an
> identical form with Flash...Flash beat the living fuck out of it 8
> ways to last week.

I don't read minds. But if that example you psoted a couple of weeks ago is
indicative of your testing my 'so-called' methodology, your results are no
big surprise. *shrug*

> What the fuck are you doin, Stupid?

Gis hacking, mugs, etc and etc.

>>>>> But then you would lose the rss xml layer and the plain text fall back
>>>>> layer...you wouldn't wanna exclude those...especially the last one,
>>>>> just think of all the BITCHING that it would cause in these froups!
>
>>>>OIC, so you plan to serve your rss in a div or iframe? Erm... okay...
>
>>> ...um, no actually. The rss needs to be in an xml file...which will
>>> be included as a simple link that users won't be able to see outright,
>>> like nyah: <a href="rss.xml"></a>
>
>>Oh. So... you're saying you can't include an rss link in your flash? C'mon
>>hatter, That's lame. Even for you.
>
> Tell me something, Stupid...how do you think a search engine is going
> to crawl through a Flash file in order to find the link.

Tell me something, mr. brilliant, what do you think teh auto-discovery
element in teh header is for? Doink!

> Drool for us a lil more, Reaper, it makes it all that much more
> amusing.

Drool, drool. Howzat? o_O

>>>>Oh yeah. That's really brilliant. Oh wait a minute. No it isn't. Guess you
>>>>missed this bit
>>>>
>>>> http://www.spyderware.net/scans/mct
>>>>
>>>>You know, last winter when you were busy using paintbrush to create teh tat
>>>>for mct? Guess what?
>>>>
>>>> "mct" = "mct.png"
>>>>
>>>>Duh-oops! So... do you have any other tricks up your sleeve? Or are you
>>>>planning to pull some more chit otter yore ass?
>
>>> ...I think you completely missed the cl00...I mean it just like sailed
>>> a good 3 or 4 miles over yer pointed lil head there.
>
>>I wouldn't be teh least bit surprised. You're welcome to spell it out. I'll
>>even don a pointy hat if it'll help. o_O
>
> You won't get it without a visual, I'll probably have one built in a
> few weeks, be patient.

Oh goody. We can hace a pageant then. -_-

>>>>False logic, huh? Did I /say/ you we<SLAP>
>
>>> It was a reference to the strawman you made in that post to Jen,
>>> Kiddo. Try and take notes if yer having trouble keeping up.
>
>>Getting a tad testy, are we? Here, maybe this will help.
>>
>>/me passes hatter some poorgulliboi's absinthe
>>
>>Bottoms up!
>
> Reaper prefers "real" Absinthe...which would certainly explain why her
> brain is so fucked up. Yeesh, she posts like a fuckin meth addict.

Pffft. My brain is so fscked up I donated it to science and they nader gave
it back. Wtf else do you think I psot to teh juicenet? o_O

>>>>Well, yeah. That /is/ the point. Doink!
>
>>> Size is better than not being able to see it at all unless you
>>> download some off the wall, no one's ever even heard of it VRML
>>> plugin.
>
>>Well, of course you haven't heard of the various x3d plugins.
>
> Hey, hey moron, if *I* haven't heard of these plugins...what in the
> fuck makes you think that ANYONE has ever heard of these plugins?
> Fuckin DUH!

How do you suppose people /hear/ of various plugins? Last I heard, osmosis
doesn't really work. So site creators are left with the obvious. Detecting
os and browser info, and serving up a link to the appropriate plugin. I
realize this concept may be tough for you to get your ladle brain around,
but do try. At teh very least, you'll make it easier for teh user if they
don't have your particular content plugin installed.

>>> You're just now experimenting with 3D chit,
>
>>No, actually, I was writing 3d vr sims back when you were still a toddler.
>
> You were writing 3D VR simulations back in 1983 were you? Tell us
> Reaper, did you also invent the Internet?

Nope, not teh Internet. That was a gore thing, iirc... though I heard he
also invented teh algorithm.

But to clarify, the vr project involved attempting to control rl mechanics
via a vr environ (think vr+robotics). This type of thing has it's uses in
situations that require human interaction, but increase terminal risk
factors (e.g., working with, say plutonium, or other radioactive chems).
It's also become useful in teh biomed arena. No matter. The biggest
challenge /at the time/ was the sensory feedback (or lack thereof, at least
initially). For example, when you pick up a chair irl, the weight let's you
know how much force to apply in order to move it to a specified position.
Though, your brain is designed to do this without actually needing to
calculate force, acceleration, etc. When trying to map such simple
movements (as picking up your chair) to vr however, minute movements often
result in exaggerated vr movements, thus putting teh chair through teh vr
roof, so to speak. Bc of this, in conjunction with the fact that we were
attempting to provide an rl feel, we ended up adding sensory feedback to
teh vr units. The result? The vr chair visually moves at teh velocity you
would expect, bc you're now making motions based upon teh physical feedback
you receive. Therefore, when you're lifting it to height-n, you'll feel
stress increase as your arms move toward teh perpendicular to your bod, and
sightly decrease as your arms continue past teh perpendicular towards a
vertical. The final result? Predictable vr movement that does not violate
real world physics.

>>My present focus is gis hacking. Teh wild hair mugs are more of a ladle
>>side project. *shrug*
>
> Got a thing for Google Earth, eh?

Not really. Though I did dl their app to take a looksee (wasn't teh least
bit impressed). I've been playing around with temporal mapping and this:
http://snipurl.com/h3kw So, for example, one could say, data mine
wikipedia and generate a temporal map conforming to a terra map based upon
teh locale info contained in teh data. The result might be an overlay in a
pseudo vr space. Another fun thing is to, say pull data for a specific
locale and provide a 3d walk-around tour. Let's say you wanted to create a
page about your hometown (or maybe about your fav hangouts). It would be a
matter of pulling the topo data, snapping a few shots of building faces,
interiors, etc, and basically utilizing usgs data for gen'ing the basic 3d
topographics, etc. Rather than rasterising the buildings, use teh pics as
textures, thus reducing end user computes. If you really have a better
method for compressing your graphics (e.g., teh pic textures), that would
reduce your end user computes even more. As for teh mugs, that's more along
teh lines of using mathematics (e.g., matricies, vectors, calculus, diff
eq, linear algebra, etc) for creating realistic scenes and characters. This
bit occurs serverside of course, and beats teh hell out of hand-drawing
chit. That, and it's more of a wild hair than anything serious.

>>> so maybe you don't know, I covered that stuff like back in 1997, even
>>> bought myself a pair of Virtual IO glasses
>
>>You did, huh? Too funny.
>
> But did you buy a glove and take advantage of the $50 display upgrade
> (they sent me that about 2 years after I bought em).

You're horrible, hatter. Horrible, I say. In answer to your question
however, yep, bought teh vr gear when it came out for teh nintendo. That
would be in teh 80s, around teh time when articles on phreaking, teh mit
borg thing, and 'do-it-yourself' vr goggles were making teh news. Course,
they've come a long way since those daze (ala moravec, etc).

>>> and did a bunch of VR experiments (didn't amount to much other than
>>> making me sick to my stomach). ^_^
>
>>You'd prolly hate teh vr lab xperiments back in teh day, then. *snicker*
>
> I found the head motion tracking to be even worse than a static
> display. It was even worse with games. Like the shipping would be
> moving in one direction but if you moved your head the shit would just
> keep going in that same direction...really disorienting, especially if
> you weren't in the cockpit view.

Yep. That's the biggest problem with the whole vr bit, which btw, is
obviated if you use teh old fashion game controller. But then, that's not
really vr. The primary reason the controller bit works well, is due to teh
fact your eye/hand coordination tracks easily to a vr display. Whereas head
gear movement detection has inherent issues with regard to calc'ing gross
movement. Thus, if you turn your head (as you normally would to, say, look
left), you can end up spinning teh vr several revolutions, or in cases
where it's reasonably calibrated, you still overshoot your desired
location. One way they attempted to address the problem was to use hud
corneal mapping. Though, that was a bit ago, and I haven't teh faintest
clue where they are with that bit these daze.

>>>>>>Oh yes. Flash games are teh schizitz.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> http://www.goriya.com/flash/flash.shtml
>>>>>>
>>>>>>*snicker*
>>>
>>>>> They are if they're made well...those ones...not so much.
>>>>>
>>>>> By the by, "made well", isn't speaking about code.
>>>
>>>>Oh yes. Ripping graphics is teh way to go. Oops! Nader mind. No it isn't.
>>>
>>> I wasn't even speaking about graphics either. And what's all this
>>> shit about "ripping graphics"? I'm pretty sure I covered it in a blog
>>> entry, Dumbass:
>>> http://www.backwater-productions.net/hatter-blog/stories/8-10-2005.png
>
>>Yes, I know. I read it. Though... anyone who's teh least bit knowlegable
>>about teh various skins that are floating around would have reconized your
>>blog look/feel right off teh bat. o_O
>
> ...and? I mean its not like Apple, Windows and every other asshole on
> the planet isn't using the same exact methods. There are only so many
> ways to create glass looking structures for example, pretty much if
> you want something to look like it's made of glass, that's the way you
> have to do it.

I think you just b0rked yourself. Or... was that fsckup of sentence
purposeful? Change your mind mid sentence? Take a break and forget wtf you
were writing? Or are you /trying/ to look like an ignoramus? o_O

>>> A lil hard to "rip graphics" when you're recreating them from scratch
>>> using your own methodology...which is superior to that of the original
>>> author. *shrugs*
>
>>Sure it is. Uh-huh. Btw, when you actually come up with a /unique/ idea,
>>would you mind pointing it out? Bc, atm, you're following teh exact same
>>path teh tech industry has already paved. Though, you're a tad behind teh
>>curve, atm.
>
> This coming from the girl who built her bot by ripping off other
> peoples bots...and I don't mean like recreating the code from scratch
> based on reverse engineering practices...I mean you quite literarily
> just copied and pasted the code without making any alterations AT ALL.

You still hace yore panties awl up in a wad over teh /one/ component I used
from sourceforge? Chit hatter. Yore too funny. That's even mentioned in teh
dot net article. So it's not exactly a secret. That, and since I replaced
it with snlp quite some time ago, it's a non-issue. But hey, if you want to
jerk off about it, be my guest. *shrug*

> And most of what I do is original in a directed sense. Frequently I
> take aspects of things that I picked up from various communities and
> then apply them to other communities in a way that no one else has
> before. Like using WinXP skin styles as a basis of graphical study to
> carry over into web design...not really too many people doin that.
> Which is a shame, most websites would look much better if they used
> such design techniques.

Imho, most web sites 'look' like chit (esp mine). Then again, in my case,
for example, I'm more interested in sandboxing ideas, than attempting to
draw visitors. If I were attempting to make money off teh site, it would be
another story. For example, I would hire a grafx artist for teh branding,
etc. As for teh windows look on teh web? Gah!

>>>>You're too funny. Really, you are. But anyway... I'm simply pointing out
>>>>that you're doing that thing again. You know, /that thing/? o_O
>
>>> ...pointing out your stupidity?
>
>>Nope. Just pointing out that your drag queen dramatics are reminiscent of
>>this: http://snipurl.com/bwxq
>
> http://www.backwater-productions.net/_images/smells_like.jpg

No offense hatter, but I'm not really interested in you're non-sex life.

>>>>You can start with, in the case of your game scenario, having to create
>>>>numerous frames to emulate 3d. And end with having to load various animated
>>>>graphic views to emulate your vr. And there is, of course, the bit
>>>>involving mathematical calcs for positioning your tweens, lighting fx, etc.
>>>>Though, since you appear to enjoy jumping through hoops, I'm sure you'll
>>>>have a blast. ^_~
>
>>> ...who ever said I wanted to make 3D games in Flash? If I wanted to make
>>> such a game it would make infinitely more sense to dump the online
>>> environment and jump right into a real object oriented language. Don't
>>> be fucking stupid, Reaper, we're talking about web design, not programming
>>> "online Doom" fer fuck sake. Yeesh.
>
>>You're teh one who mentioned you were writing a game.
>
> ...no, not really.

So... lemme see if I have this right. You were spewing bullchit when you
psoted this in teh context of your faux 3d layout?

<news:lhhbc1lp1to44c5926kvtnpqssar9besbo@4ax.com>

After I get the content added in, I'm going to actually recreate
a portion of the original Battle of Olympus video game in the
upper portion of the site (just below the sky, between the
columns). And did I mention I'm going to make it playable?

Erm...okay. o_O

>>I simply /assumed/ you would be doing a 3d impl.
>
> ...if I were going to make a game I wouldn't do it in 3D...I'm a lil
> bit "old sk00l", I like most of my games 2D...unless they're just
> really, really, REALLY good.

Pffft. Not even. 'Old sk00l' is text-based games. And /real/ old school is
teh abacus.

>>Do however forgive me if I overestimated your
>>/austere/ programing capabilities. *smirk*
>
> Well you must be underestimating them if you think I would make a 3D
> game using a scripting language fer fuck sake.

You otter stick width your video editing. Cuz, frankly speaking, yore mind
reading skillz suck teh big kahuna.

--
"I think and think for months and years. Ninety-nine times, the conclusion
is false. The hundredth time I am right." -- Albert Einstein

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