|
|
Posted by Weird-beard on 10/19/05 10:44
Peter,
Java is the ruler in all cool subjects nowadays. dotnet is too
borrowing a lot from java. Why not use java, instead just borrowing
from it ? Thats a question I ask myself too.
I might make some php coders angry with such talk, as I might be
seeming promoting java in a php forum, but I like php. I dont know why,
but I like it. Maybe the open source thing, not being tied or related
to any company or corporation, or open source projects written with it.
I just like it, and I want php to be better and more serious,to be
considered serious, not only on the open source community but also in
the commercial ones.
Learning java is one problem, I guess. Not the syntax, but the
infrastructure. J2EE, EJB, JDBC, Beans, Session Beans, JMS, JNDI and a
lot of buzzword starting with J. Its just though to know where to
start. whats tougher about learning java is learning to write java
efficiently, or learning to need it.
As such discussions or hours of searching makes you familiar with
concepts such as MVC, php users rarely see that stuff or are interested
in. You must crave for smth before you learn it. There are concepts
such as MVC, design patterns, persistence layers, abstraction layers, n
layered application, unit testing et etc etc. As a minority of advanced
php coders know or care about the subjects, almost every java coder has
smth to say on these. So, there is a lot more info, as the users are
much more knowledgable about the general aspects such as frameworks.
Even dotnet users does not have these skills.
Comparing it to php,
Advantages
- Php is easy to learn and code
- Can do alot of things in php easily
- There are a lot of resources available
- There are a lot of modules and open source projects,
- Code written by alot of people is available on the web
- It is really faster to code in php
- Weak typed, so things are easier to do
Disadvantages
- the community is interested about 'easy to learn and code' concept
- We want to do things easily
- We are not very much aware of new subjects.
- As has not been accepted yet by corporates, no or very small amount
of big projects done with php
- The developers are beginner to intermediate level, a few software
architects interested in php, the community in general lacks knowledge
- weak typed, so for eg you can pass anything as a parameter into the
function, crippling encapsulation, using any object for an attribute in
a class etc.
I dont care if strong typed languages takes more to code. I care about
the bug fix, the reusability. I think that code has to force me into
doing smth that I previously wanted myself or other fellow to do like
it.
Php has made a move towards that in 5.0, giving you the chance to
define the classes of the parameters to a function.
Yes, it takes a lot more in strong typed languages, casting,
inheriting, declaring abstract classes and such. But, it gives you alot
more control, when designing huge systems.
Peter, onto the other questions, the biggest plus of java is its
community I think. There are a lot of mvc frameworks for java, each
being used in commercial projects for a long time. Yes, it is possible
to develop Java apps for free. You need Eclipse as IDE, JBoss as
Appserver (or Apache Tomcat) and Mysql or anyth. Why do we choose php ?
Cause using java only makes sense when you need some other aspects of
programming. The best framework for MVC is struts written in java for
java, for eg. If I do not know what MVC is, why bother ? So first I
need to know whats available in software engineering.
But, a huge but here, I do not thnik the language matters. I think it
matters how you code. There are a lot of successful studies and
projects for php, and will be more and more, 5.0 has accelerated the
community and people like me have started to investigate subjects as
design patterns. Soon php coders will too be let into the community of
serious developers. Some of current php users are really annoyed from
the path that php is changing to, as they are very furious about the
5.0 's oop features. I dont know the percentage.
Anyway, phyton and ruby draws a lot of attention nowadays, at least
mine.
-
> petermichaux@yahoo.com wrote:
> > Hi Weird-beard,
> >
> > Because of this thread I've been looking into MVC frameworks for PHP.
> > It seems like in the whole professional world of PHP there is a lot of
> > borrowing from Java. I wonder why people want to borrow from Java
> > instead of just using Java. Maybe PHP users like me need to know more
> > about the world of Java. How is it different from PHP for web
> > development? compiled, strongly typed,...? Why do we choose PHP over
> > Java for mid to large size projects? Is it possible to develop
> > Apache/Mysql/Java apps in a free, open source way like using PHP on
> > Windows, OS X or Linux?
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Peter
> >
Navigation:
[Reply to this message]
|